Rats…Just when I had put it on my Must hear list!
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Well, if it’s a new discovery, it’s still must hear content. Plenty of classic episodes that are still relevant.
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Just curious if direct plays from the TWiT website count towards show numbers or if it is just subscriptions / downloads.
It’s probably a small number, but there might be others like me who only watch via the website (I know, weirdos). 
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That is too bad, it was one my my favorites. But I understand, that you need to have shows that more people watch.
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We count it no matter how you download it. Subscriptions help just because it helps us make it on the various lists maintained by the podcatchers. People think the Top Podcast lists are based on downloads, they never are. It’s always based on new subscriptions. Even iTunes. In other words, new shows are strongly favored. The older podcasts like ours are not growing as fast, so we don’t get featured as often, so we don’t grow as fast, etc.
I understand the problem with Triangulation. I do the same thing with Fresh Air. I only listen to the interviews that interest me. Which cuts the download numbers significantly. We always knew that that would hurt the overall numbers. We kept the show going at a loss for years anyway because I thought it was important.
Unfortunately the way podcasts are structured very much favors a few distinct formats over others. As long as we have to care about downloads that’s the way it’s going to be. I’m not happy about it but those are the facts of life in media, alas.
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I should probably write a blog post on this, because I don’'t know how well it’s understood by the non-media public. But in a nutshell…
Ad-supported networks, like TWiT, rely on consistent listening. In general, it will take 4-7 impressions (listens) before an ad works. On a show that’s listened to every week, an advertiser need only buy four to seven ads to succeed.
With an interview show like Triangulation, most of the audience only listens to the interviews they’re interested in. Let’s say it’s one in five. That means even though 100,000 people might say they “listen” to Triangulation, any given episode is only going to get 20,000 downloads. An advertiser will have to buy 5x the number of ads to reach the same number of impressions on any given listener. Which makes Triangulation five times more expensive than a show that you listen to every week.
Interview shows are more viable in subscription media. NPR’s Fresh Air is a fantastic show - the gold standard for interview shows - but it wouldn’t survive on ad-supported network. It does great in a subscription or listener-supported environment because, let’s say, 100,000 people love it enough to subscribe, even though they might only listen to one in five shows.
That’s why broadcast media, and podcasts, produce mostly shows that generate consistent weekly listens. It’s why shows like Serial do so well, you have to listen every week. It’s why shows like Triangulation do so poorly. It sad, but it’s true.
We’ve never experimented with the subscription model on TWiT. It’s hard to get people to pay for shows they’ve been getting for free. And I worry that our technically sophisticated audience would make a pay-wall porous pretty quickly.
But I wanted you to understand why you hear one kind of programming on ad-supported networks, and another on listener-supported channels. We carried Triangulation for as long as we could, but we ultimately can’t produce shows that lose money. It breaks my heart, but that’s just the way it it.
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@Leo Apologies if you’ve already addressed this, but have you considered adding a subscription tier to TWiT? I’d subscribe for a nominal monthly fee.
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As an advertising software guy, this makes sense. We struggle with publishers who have amazing content and quality audiences, yet are too spread out to create impact for the demand side.
The good news on this topic is that there is an incredible back-catalog of interviews. Leo, do you plan on maintaining them or should we download the oeuvre now?
Thanks,
Steve B.
@Leo I would too, lots of podcasts that I see have started adding subscription to get early access and things of that nature just saying.
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See the second to last paragraph. I don’t think we’d be very good at subscription podcasts.
The back catalog of shows on Triangulation will always be available at https://twit.tv/tri
I did, in fact, write an expanded blog post at https://leolaporte.com
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I understand, I was just pointing out what I had seen going on is all. In no way would I try to tell you how to run your stuff. You are definitely much more of an expert at podcasting than I am.
Thanks for sharing that Leo. I bet it’s not easy to cancel something you really seemed to enjoy doing.
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I’m glad you have the Triangulation episodes archived for us to watch. @Leo what are your top 3 Triangulation interviews (all years, not just this past year)? Something for me to go back and re-watch. 
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Well done Leo on a great achievement, I know it didn’t make you money but it’s a valuable document of the wider ecosystem and the thinkers and actors within it. It may be over but as an archive it has tremendous value.
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I’m sorry to see Triangulation go, but I understand why. Hopefully, special one-off interviews could pop up from time to time when someone interesting is making the media rounds.
I especially look forward to folks like Daniel Suarez chatting about his latest book, for example.
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Definitely. I’ve reserved the right to do one-on-one interviews as Specials whenever.
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Oooh! Well that’s very good news! 
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It certainly did have a long good run, but just like any show they come and go even when some episodes do have good numbers. Sometimes they go off for economic reasons, host issues, or a natural conclusion is made.
Another theory I think as to why this show was cancelled was perhaps that it switched to rotating hosts in the last 2 years or so.
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There were times when hosts rotated in the past: Jason Howell, Megan Morrone & Fr. Robert have all done periods of hosting, so that probably doesn’t mean much. After all, Leo has to be allowed some vacation!
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The only drawback with the way the shows are laid out on the website is that the text can be cut off before the guest name is shown. What I did notice is that there have been quite a few interviews of people “in the TWiT family” of guests and presenters. In case anyone is interested, I’ll list those episodes:
8 Bob Heil
20 Chris Marquadt
28 Jeff Jarvis
68 Dick DeBartolo
70 Jessica Corbin (ex Screen Savers)
96 Andy Ihnatko
112 Leo himself!
138 Alex Lindsay
144 Steve Gibson pt 1
147 Steve Gibson pt 2
160 Mary Jo Foley
173 Jason Snell
329 Mike Elgan
342 Oh Doctah
397 Brianna Wu
Just my selection, but you might be interested in them too, amongst all the other “movers and shakers” interviewed over the years.
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