# WW 853: Ten Outta Ten for the 404! **URL:** \ **Category:** Windows Weekly\ **Tags:** episode\ **Created:** [November 2, 2023, 1:02am UTC](https://www.twit.community/t/ww-853-ten-outta-ten-for-the-404/15464 "2023-11-02T01:02:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Leo](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/www.twit.community/leo/32/16203_2.png) [@Leo](https://www.twit.community/u/Leo)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2023, 1:02am UTC](https://www.twit.community/t/ww-853-ten-outta-ten-for-the-404/15464/1 "2023-11-02T01:02:29Z")
Beep boop - this is a robot. A new show has been posted to TWiT… > **[Ten Outta Ten for the 404! | TWiT.TV](https://twit.tv/shows/windows-weekly/episodes/853)** > > On this episode, Leo, Paul, and Richard discuss the big release of Windows 11 23H2, productivity in Macs vs PCs, Microsoft 365 Copilot arriving, changes in the Xbox and marketing d… What are your thoughts about today’s show? We’d love to hear from you! ---
**Author:** ![knewman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/www.twit.community/knewman/32/1153_2.png) [@knewman](https://www.twit.community/u/knewman)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2023, 2:08am UTC](https://www.twit.community/t/ww-853-ten-outta-ten-for-the-404/15464/2 "2023-11-02T02:08:07Z")
That 5% market share jump for MacOS is wild! The timing is so strange too, was the M2 just such a better chip? Or maybe it just took that long for the “normals” to notice the efficiency gains of the ARM switchover? Teams is still a trash application, just slightly less so now that it’s on WebView rather than Electron. Microsoft’s own commisioned report on the performance increases vs. Electron-based Teams tells the whole story ([https://gigaom.com/report/new-microsoft-teams-performance-benchmark/](https://gigaom.com/report/new-microsoft-teams-performance-benchmark/)). In what world is it acceptable to take 1.5-2 seconds to merely switch between chats? These UX latencies matter _so much_ in user perception of a piece of software. The success of iOS showed us that. Feel like I’m taking crazy pills here. I contend that there’s a serious and concerning lack of low level programming skill at the core of Teams development. It is possible, however rare to see in practice, to code an effective and performant Electron program, even if it’s not necessarily efficient with system resources. Take a look at Discord. ---
**Author:** ![maguswine](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/www.twit.community/maguswine/32/10091_2.png) [@maguswine](https://www.twit.community/u/maguswine)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2023, 7:45pm UTC](https://www.twit.community/t/ww-853-ten-outta-ten-for-the-404/15464/3 "2023-11-02T19:45:06Z")
I can see why people aren’t upgrading to Windows 11. My processor is officially not compatible with it, and seeing as how it’s practically Windows 10 under the hood, I’ll stick to using it. I’m not convinced Apple’s impact on the industry has been good. I still remember nine years ago having a laptop that I could upgrade the drive and the RAM myself because they were accessible via compartments on the bottom, so I could unscrew the cover, take the thing out, and put another one in. I’m also still seeing laptops selling for about £500, and, honestly, I’d rather buy a laptop for £500, or just over, and then upgrade parts of it as and when I have money to do so than spend £1,200 or more upfront. ---
**Author:** ![big\_D](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/www.twit.community/big_d/32/1023_2.png) [@big\_D](https://www.twit.community/u/big_D)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2023, 5:20am UTC](https://www.twit.community/t/ww-853-ten-outta-ten-for-the-404/15464/4 "2023-11-03T05:20:57Z")
The problem is not the lack of low level programming skills per se, but that even if they had them, they are using a web browser based technology to write a program that needs high performance, the two will never make a workable mix. You would have thought that a company like Microsoft would have some programmers who know how to program for Windows… ---
**Author:** ![big\_D](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/www.twit.community/big_d/32/1023_2.png) [@big\_D](https://www.twit.community/u/big_D)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2023, 5:27am UTC](https://www.twit.community/t/ww-853-ten-outta-ten-for-the-404/15464/5 "2023-11-03T05:27:58Z")
It depends on what you want. The main draw of a Mac is macOS, you can’t get that on a $500 laptop, only Windows or Linux. Some people may like the design, but, for me, it was macOS, combined with the power efficiency - electricity prices went up between 150 and 200% last year, so anything that provides the performance of my Ryzen 1700 desktop, but uses a fraction of the electricity to do so is welcome in my book. I still have the Ryzen, a couple of Raspis, a Mac mini and 2 older Windows laptops. The 2010 Vaio had its HDD replaced with an SSD, but the 2016 HP Spectre has never been opened - my wife uses it now. Likewise, the Ryzen desktop has plenty of room for expansion, apart from adding a 2nd SSD when I bought it, it hasn’t been opened or expanded in 6 years. I don’t like the all-in-one design of the Macs in some ways but as long as they are reliable and hold together for a long time, it doesn’t bother me that much. My last Mac, a 2007 iMac ran until 2019, when the motherboard died - although it stopped getting security updates in 2012, so it was only used for Linux and Windows in latter years.